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John DeJ Profile
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Re: This sickens me


Never put your opinions on what someone else thinks.

People are not upset when a cemetery has to be moved, so I don't see the problem here.
7/16/2009, 7:57 am Link to this post Send Email to John DeJ   Send PM to John DeJ
 
AguyinaRPG Profile
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Re: This sickens me


quote:

John DeJ wrote:

Here's the problem - and I can't believe I am with Ulapz on this - there are better ways to symbolize the fallen.

The dead have no "wishes", they are dead.

Is this public land? Could I put a Swastika next to it and say "I want to remember the Nazis that have fallen?"

When honoring the dead of a particular area, the symbol is what is important. How does a cross remind you of people that have died in a combat situation?

And I'd still like to know why the ACLU wants to take it down.



This is actualy very truthful. While the ACLU is a bunch of a-holes, look at how this has brought everyone together to defend it. They don't care about the Cross, they care about what it stands for. So if it's taken down, they can still remember the fallen because of what it stood for.
7/16/2009, 7:58 am Link to this post Send Email to AguyinaRPG   Send PM to AguyinaRPG
 
Zalabar Profile
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Re: This sickens me


quote:

John DeJ wrote:
People are not upset when a cemetery has to be moved, so I don't see the problem here.



using the term "people" too broadly,

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7/16/2009, 8:26 am Link to this post Send Email to Zalabar   Send PM to Zalabar
 
John DeJ Profile
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Re: This sickens me


Zal, don't nitpick words.

Are you seeing people being upset over the before mentioned topic?

No. You are seeing this one.

You will always have someone upset about a topic, even if the sole reason is because they want to buck the system.
7/16/2009, 9:42 am Link to this post Send Email to John DeJ   Send PM to John DeJ
 
Zalabar Profile
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Re: This sickens me


yup, that's me. a near master-mixer. emoticon

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7/16/2009, 1:54 pm Link to this post Send Email to Zalabar   Send PM to Zalabar
 
bambi711 Profile
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Re: This sickens me


To respond to the Grandfather clause from John DeJ:

I like to believe you. However, as time passes by, old things would no longer be protected if it becomes a taboo to do it.

You say that the new law, when implemented, won't affect all the cemeteries and US memorials today is true, but in the future, the law will have consequences. That is what I believe about precedents; the effects are never immediate, but the consequences from the new law will take place as time passes, even unaccounted ones.
For example, when the Supreme Court banned prayer to be performed publicly in the public schools, the enforcement was not instant. It took time for the school to enforce the Court decision. Through time, teachers and school officials developed the idea that prayer should not be part of the school. That effect was unaccounted, for people in school can privately or in assembly with other believers in school, as long it is not public. However, the effects can be seen that, today, students and teachers have an idea that religion should not allowed in any part of school. To me, that means no praying even I was in a Christian club.

I believe that when anybody wants to put something on his or her headstone that he or she can be remembered as, the person could do it even though it may contain religious connotation. I believe that is the present perspective for our culture on life and death. From this new law, the offended minority change our culture through use of government power.
This case worries me, because, if the Court agrees, it means more than the fact that we can't express our feelings for the veteran by the cross on the government land. The cross would increasingly become a taboo among the Nazis and evil symbols.

From this case, once again, our culture would think that anything related to religion is not supposed to be publicized, though the purpose may not be religious such as the using the cross to remember veterans. The offended minority are using it by government force, which is something to be afraid.

To respond to the second one, John DeJ:

I really don't know what the government do with land. I hope that government would still keep the land as a memorial for our veterans.
7/16/2009, 4:49 pm Link to this post Send Email to bambi711   Send PM to bambi711
 
ulapz Profile
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Re: This sickens me


I also hope it will stay a memorial, i just believe that they shouldn't be using a religious symbol to memorialize the fallen soldiers, and zal, if they wan't it gone it doesn't mean they hate our soldiers, it means that they see something wrong with the using of a religious symbol for a memorial.
7/18/2009, 12:21 pm Link to this post  
 
DreadFox Profile
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Re: This sickens me


well the way i see it , it was many soldiers who went to the mojave desert and set up that cross. Why is it now such a big deal to people that it must be taken down,its a symbol like many other things and the US was built on a Christian based governmental system last time i checker "under God" is still there i say let it stand all the people out there have to stop picking at anythign or everything they dont like it seems now and days if someone doesnt like something or someone they take it to court people need to learn to be able to accept things instead of fighting anything they dont like. I say let the cross stay!
7/19/2009, 11:18 pm Link to this post Send Email to DreadFox   Send PM to DreadFox
 
Zalabar Profile
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Re: This sickens me


you know, that kinda simplified everything I said, and mean, no strings attached. emoticon

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7/20/2009, 8:09 am Link to this post Send Email to Zalabar   Send PM to Zalabar
 
Dusky Beauty Profile
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Re: This sickens me


This is Mojave in AZ? I have a lawyer friend from that area, I wonder what the local take on all of it is.

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UO: Reatha Starfell, CoH: Dusk Fairchild, WoW: Qurr, Pursia, Flaire, WAR: Dusk Starfelle
7/20/2009, 2:05 pm Link to this post Send Email to Dusky Beauty   Send PM to Dusky Beauty ICQ AIM
 


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