Runboard.com
You're welcome.
Community logo


runboard.com       Sign up (learn about it) | Sign in (lost password?)


Page:  1  2  3  4  5 

 
Bearanimations Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

Registered user
Global user

Registered: 04-2009
Posts: 37
Reply | Quote
Re: This sickens me


quote:

BMDennis wrote:

I tweeted it, thanks for the video.



np.
7/13/2009, 5:44 pm Link to this post Send Email to Bearanimations   Send PM to Bearanimations
 
ulapz Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

Registered user
Global user

Registered: 02-2008
Posts: 1533
Reply | Quote
Re: This sickens me


i can see both sides of the story.

The ACLU and its supporters are offended by the use of a christian religious symbol to memorialize fallen soldiers and want to have it removed.

The people against this motion see the memorial as well, a memorial and that it shouldn't be removed.

i say remove the cross but put in something non-religious to symbolize it to make everyone happy.
7/13/2009, 7:21 pm Link to this post  
 
SuXuemei Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

Registered user
Global user

Registered: 04-2009
Location: Anchorage, AK
Posts: 85
Reply | Quote
Re: This sickens me


ULAPZ,

Shouldn't the wishes of, I dunno, the dead people being honored be considered?

Seriously, if anyone's offended by the mere existence of Christianity (and it seems more and more like this) then go live under a rock and let us go about our business showing respect for the dead.
7/13/2009, 10:14 pm Link to this post Send Email to SuXuemei   Send PM to SuXuemei
 
John DeJ Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

Registered user
Global user

Registered: 08-2007
Posts: 2105
Reply | Quote
Re: This sickens me


Here's the problem - and I can't believe I am with Ulapz on this - there are better ways to symbolize the fallen.

The dead have no "wishes", they are dead.

Is this public land? Could I put a Swastika next to it and say "I want to remember the Nazis that have fallen?"

When honoring the dead of a particular area, the symbol is what is important. How does a cross remind you of people that have died in a combat situation?

And I'd still like to know why the ACLU wants to take it down.
7/14/2009, 4:01 am Link to this post Send Email to John DeJ   Send PM to John DeJ
 
Bearanimations Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

Registered user
Global user

Registered: 04-2009
Posts: 37
Reply | Quote
Re: This sickens me


The dead still have wishes though when they're alive, and if that means a memorial in the shape of a cross (the way our country has always done it), then it should be honored. Second, the main point of the conflict is that the cross was origionally put up on private property, which eventually became controlled by the government. The ACLU wants to take it down because they say it means the government endorses Christianity, and because they are anti-american.

Thirdly, you could not erect a swastika anywhere you wanted in this country without getting arrested, because that is an anti-american symbol.

7/14/2009, 2:17 pm Link to this post Send Email to Bearanimations   Send PM to Bearanimations
 
bambi711 Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

Registered user
Global user

Registered: 04-2009
Posts: 25
Reply | Quote
Re: This sickens me


This is an issue that makes me sad and angry.

Even though the cross, a Christian symbol, is on public property, this is what the soldiers who made the memorial in the Mojave Desert want to be remember for.

A Nazis symbol, demonic symbol, and Soviet Union, or any evil-looking symbols would never be on the US veteran cemetery, because the US veteran would chose not to be recognized by those symbols. (Duh?) Most US veterans have religious symbols on their headstones because that is what they are part of, who they are. In the same way, living veterans of the WWI, WWII, Korean War, Vietnam War, and Gulf War, and today's war should be able to have the cross or any symbol on their memorial. So, can we really consider the opinions of people offended by the cross over the people who fought for our freedoms, our country, and us? Shouldn't the veterans be able to choose what symbol they want in their memorial to be remember as? In addition, though the dead people may be dead, but it is not necessarily true that their relatives and friends and comrades are dead but alive - and they are fighting this issue to the Supreme Court.

If the Supreme Court agrees, it will make precedents to take down all religious symbols on US memorial vetern cemetery on public land. Plus, by this trend, I fear that this will also occur on private cemetery. "Sorry you can't put a cross, star of David, the Crescent Moon, for this person, for it may offend other people who might come to cemetery." That's business.

As the for neutral symbols argument, if the symbol of the cross can't be defended and be tear down, what makes any neutral symbol safe? Our American flags can be burned, the headstones can be marked by graffiti. What symbol could be protected if a minority is offended by it? In addition, this is not a good argument. Realistically, we are letting the offended use the government to bully our veterans and force the veterans to conform to their view of what a memorial should look like.

Will a giant statue of the veteran be good enough?
[sign in to see URL] the US veterans in the Mojave Desert don't want the giant statue of solider, they want the cross. Therefore, let us respect their utmost humble request and honor them by leaving the cross uncover and stand. This will show to all future soldiers that they will be respected when they fight and die in battle for us.

Lastly, I think that, if the Supreme Court agrees, will be disgrace to all of our veterans. I am already angry at our society because sometimes I see veterans living homeless. Other veterans beg for money to pay for their medical bills, holding a cardboard sign, "God bless you," on the street as I go and leave school (my university has a VA hospital). I can't believe this case is happening, because I see old veterans, in the video, fighting in our country for their right to let the cross be their memorable symbol. I want our country to respect and honor these veterans; stop pushing them around and be in this political mess. Let them keep their memorial symbol uncover.
7/14/2009, 3:51 pm Link to this post Send Email to bambi711   Send PM to bambi711
 
John DeJ Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

Registered user
Global user

Registered: 08-2007
Posts: 2105
Reply | Quote
Re: This sickens me


First off, thanks bambi. I still can't view the video, but you gave me the missing piece I was looking for.

Symbolism is very big in this issue, but what this comes down to is two things:

1) The Grandfather Clause of Law issues. Basically, if something is in existence before another change comes into effect, it is protected from the new law.

2) What was/is the plans for the land now that the government owns it? Did they intend to do something with the land that the cross now occupies?

  
7/15/2009, 5:41 am Link to this post Send Email to John DeJ   Send PM to John DeJ
 
ulapz Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

Registered user
Global user

Registered: 02-2008
Posts: 1533
Reply | Quote
Re: This sickens me


quote:

John DeJ wrote:

Here's the problem - and I can't believe I am with Ulapz on this - there are better ways to symbolize the fallen.

The dead have no "wishes", they are dead.

Is this public land? Could I put a Swastika next to it and say "I want to remember the Nazis that have fallen?"

When honoring the dead of a particular area, the symbol is what is important. How does a cross remind you of people that have died in a combat situation?

And I'd still like to know why the ACLU wants to take it down.



wow you hate having to side with me kinda, huh. am i really that hated around here lol?

sux: the dead are dead, they aren't coming back and no ghostly apparitions are going to haunt us. the dead may have or may not have wanted a memorial. so its may not be their wish to have it, we don't know that. it's their families' wish to have it there so they can remember,
7/15/2009, 10:01 am Link to this post  
 
Bearanimations Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

Registered user
Global user

Registered: 04-2009
Posts: 37
Reply | Quote
Re: This sickens me


[sign in to see URL]

Just another link I found interesting, maybe related to this one, but I didn't want to make another thread.
7/15/2009, 4:45 pm Link to this post Send Email to Bearanimations   Send PM to Bearanimations
 
Zalabar Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

Registered user
Global user

Registered: 08-2007
Location: Alaska, anchorage,
Posts: 3068
Reply | Quote
Re: This sickens me


So, this monument was built by the veterens that survived to honor their fallen comrades, to make a place to make peace with their demons that might haunt them to this day.

And some Roman Catholic that prays to god, a follower of christ, seen quite a few holy crosses. Sues because a cross that's to honor the memory of the fallen where most were also Christians from diffrent countries that fought together in the name of freedom from oppression, to end genocide, and so on?

sounds like to me either this guy hates our soldiers that live and died to defend our country, thinks that a cross that is used as a memorial instead of at a holy site blasphamy, or is just a sheer jerk that decided "hm, what would happen if I said this offends me..."

---

7/16/2009, 7:39 am Link to this post Send Email to Zalabar   Send PM to Zalabar
 


Add a reply

Page:  1  2  3  4  5 





You are not logged in (login)

Main

Introduction

Forum

Novels

Short Stories

Poetry

Games

Movies

Reason

Store